Meta Friday

[rodo]

Confessions of a Reader

As some of you might have noticed, I don't comment much. On anything. I know that this is generally considered to be a bad thing in fandom, but I can't help it. I just refuse to comment when all I have to say is "Well, it was good", because for some reason people don't appreciate comments like that. I've often been told that I am just not enthusiastic enough when I try to tell people that their stuff was... well, good.

Another reason why I don't comment much is that most of the time, I simply don't have anything to say. Yes, really. It's nothing personal, I just can't come up with something witty or thoughtful enough to add to what you, dear reader, already said in your post. So don't feel insulted if I don't reply to your posts most of the time.

I guess this is the reason why I always feel slightly insulted when people de-friend me because I didn't comment enough. I can understand it if you de-friend me because you're not interested in reading my journal, God knows I don't write nearly as much as I would like to, but because I don't comment? Sorry, I just don't understand it. But maybe that's because I don't expect anyone to comment on my journal, friend or not.

And even though I do write, I still spend most of my time online as a reader. A reader who is not worth much, in the eyes of some, because I don't comment. So I have a proposition for you: If you want to know if I read your story/entry/whatever, and if you're a paid user, why not put a poll at the end of the post, asking your readers if they read it, and if they liked it or disliked it, while still encouraging them to comment?

Comments

[swtalmnd.insanejournal.com]

Here from metametameta.

I think that "Well, it was good" is really a very mixed-message comment, I'm sorry. The "well" at the beginning implies a tone of voice that's just really, um, unimpressed to say the least. Have you tried finding a different standard that isn't quite so dry? "This was good, I enjoyed it," would be an excellent comment to me, and mean the same thing (I hope), without that sense that what you're really saying is, "Well, it was good, but so what?"

As for the rest, as someone who reads about 1/4 of my actual flist because of porn-locking issues, I'm definitely one of those who filters for boredom rather than lack of commentary -- and on the other side of the coin, someone with whom I have a lot of dialog isn't necessarily someone I'm going to go read, if their journal is boring. But that's a matter of style -- some people want a dialog with all of their friends, and that's their prerogative. For everyone who reads like me, there's a million people that read in a dozen filters, or one big swath, or once a month, or not at all. I just try not to be offended when my commenting or writing style doesn't meet up to whatever that other person's standards are for a good experience -- and sometimes I even succeed. ;)

[ciaan.insanejournal.com]

I've seen that poll suggestion before, and I actually tried it one time. It... was kinda sad-making. If I get only a few comments on fic I assume that means not many people read it, but I can always reassure myself that maybe lots of other people did and just didn't comment. Somehow it was harder to tell myself that lots of people read without clicking the "I read it" button on the poll.

[branchandroot]

I do that in my fic archive, and it seems to work pretty well. Especially for the old fic, interestingly. When someone's blasting through a whole section of the archive in a few days, the ticky-box usually seems to get a workout. I figure, if I want comments, best to give people options.

here from meta friday

[sdk]

I have to agree with a commenter above me that the example you used "Well, that was good" sort of seems negative to me as well. I think, too, that it's the 'Well' in the beginning of the sentence that makes it sound like the tone is slightly sarcastic or implies "it could have been better." A simple declaration of enjoyment like the example "I enjoyed this." or "This is good!" would please me greatly if it was a comment to one of my stories.

I have to say that as a writer, I enjoy each and everyone of the comments I get, even if its short or just says, "Aww, cute!" But I remember I used to be very shy in leaving comments myself when I couldn't figure out what to say, or articulate even why I enjoyed a particular fic or even a piece of art. It wasn't until I started writing and posting that writing online that I got better at commenting.

But as far as regular journal entries, I sometimes have no time to comment at all because I can barely keep up with my flist. I read everything, but yeah, sometimes I just run out of time, so I certainly understand when people on my flist don't comment to all of my entries in return. I also remember being a very shy commenter period, so I would never cut someone off my flist if they didn't comment enough. I don't necessarily always add people back in the first place though, unless I know them or they do comment once to say, Hi, I'm suchandsuch and I'm friending you because I enjoy reading your journal--or something similar to that.

Anyway, long story short, I'm sorry that people de-friend you because of your lack of commenting. I don't think that's cool at all. :/

As far as the poll idea goes, I put a hit counter on my fics so I can see if they're being read or not, and that helps me feel better even if there are a lack of comments. As far as my regular entries are concerned, I just don't worry about it. I realize that people have lives and don't always have time to comment on my entries and stuff. I definitely don't get upset about it.

[eumelkeks.insanejournal.com]

There is nothing wrong with being a reader. However, the internet does not offer a great variety of ways to communicate. The easiest way in fandom is to comment and post. I would not defriend anyone for simply not commenting enough but I can understand that people may feel otherwise and think that communication is a little one-sided. Journals, fiction, art etc. strive on interaction between users.

As bad as it is, fanfiction.net offers a good way to see how many people clicked to read a story. I freely admit that it is disappointing to work on a fic for months and then get 5 comments while seeing that 500 people clicked to read and some even put one on author or story alert.

[iulia_linnea.insanejournal.com]

I've heard the polling idea before, and I may try it because I'm someone who is always thrilled to see the hit counts on my archived works go up, even if no one has commented on the fics. The only reason I might not do it is that it seems akin to review-begging, which I never like in others and wouldn't want to do, myself. *considers*

[alisanne.insanejournal.com]

Speaking as a writer, I have to agree with those who have already said that any comment for a fic is appreciated.
I get a lot of comments like "Yay!" or "So good!" as well as more detailed and critical evaluations, and I appreciate both types. Really. Please don't feel that your comment, even if it's one line, or even one word, goes unnoticed, because it doesn't.
As for enthusiasm, that's appreciated, but a "That was good" or "I liked that" comment is fine.

Defriending is a whole different topic. I think journals need to rename flists something more neutral like subscription lists or something, as journals are more akin to magazines. We all have interests change and defriending can be quite wank inducing.

And I agree with iulia_linnea that a poll would feel as if I am begging for responses. I'd rather just have people comment if they feel moved to do so.

Nice meta, btw!

[blnchflr]

I decided not to comment on this back when, since my reply is basically a defensive defense wots defensive :o) - but I guess if I'm one of the people you're wondering about, here's my POV:

I know that this is generally considered to be a bad thing in fandom
I don't think I think it's a bad thing - there are tons of things I don't comment on, because I have nothing to say. But I'm aware, and think it fair that my lack of response may have consequences (whoa, this sounds really defensive - I don't mean it that way, but I do mean it. Ehm).

I'm in fandom for two things: 1) Enjoying fannish works (fic, meta, vids, etc.); 2) Interacting with other fen. Just like in RL, my interest in other people is dependent on their interest in me. Exceptions are those that produce stuff I'm just so goddamn interested in, I could care less about their interest in me. In fandom that would be e.g. writers whose writing I love to bits.

When someone has me friended, but rarely/never comments, I assume they're not reading or just not interested in my posts. They may be, but how am I supposed to tell :o) ? If I'm thinking someone isn't interested in my journal, I'm likely to feel less and less interest in their journal.

To me, it's not unlike having a RL friend who always wants you to listen to her, but doesn't want to listen back, or only wants to hang at her place, never at yours, or only wants to do things together if she gets to decide what to do, etc. I've stopped wasting time on people like that in RL, and yeah, I do to an extent equate IJ/LJ "friends" with such a relationship. If communication/interaction is a one-sided, I'd rather spend my time and energy reading and commenting on journals who are about two-way interaction.

And I know it's elitist and bitchy and what-not. But like I've said many times before, I simply don't get fandom blues/burn-out anymore the way I did back when I was afraid to defriend people and dutifully kept them and at least skimmed their entries, sometimes commented, although the communication back was near non-existent.

So, it's how I use IJ/LJ, it's what works best for me at this point in time. For what it's worth I always feel tremendously guilty about defriending people :o) ! But it's still better than feeling like I'm wasting my time on someone who isn't interested back.

(And then there's the whole thing about f-locked entries: Not that I make many, but if I f-lock it's for a reason, and if I don't interact much with someone, I'm unlikely to want them to read my f-locked entries - makee sense?)

[rood.insanejournal.com]

I do to an extent equate IJ/LJ "friends" with such a relationship. If communication/interaction is a one-sided, I'd rather spend my time and energy reading and commenting on journals who are about two-way interaction.

I guess you use your flist in a different way, that's all. To me, it's about reading someone's journal, that's all. Not about any sort of relationship. I think it's entirely possible to have an online relationship of sorts without friending a journal, just by meeting in the comments of a community.

To me, it's not unlike having a RL friend who always wants you to listen to her, but doesn't want to listen back, or only wants to hang at her place, never at yours, or only wants to do things together if she gets to decide what to do, etc.

Sounds suspiciously like my flatmate :(. But I understand what you're trying to say, and I guess that helped me to understand why people feel the need to defriend non-commenters. My interest depends on the contents of a journal, as I said above, that's all. Of course, communication is always a plus. But to you, it's "dependent on their interest", to you, communication is not just a plus, but the purpose of a flist (Am I right?).

I think this problem could be solved by establishing reading lists alongside the flists, but I guess that would just be too much of a bother.

[blnchflr]

I guess you use your flist in a different way, that's all.
Yup.

to you, it's "dependent on their interest", to you, communication is not just a plus, but the purpose of a flist (Am I right?).
Partly - again, there are journals I have friended that I don't interact with (or all interaction only happens on their turf). So, definitely, but not exclusively.

I think this problem could be solved by establishing reading lists alongside the flists, but I guess that would just be too much of a bother.
My f-list is my reading list, though :oP ! And as far as splitting them up into "people I interact with" and "people I don't interact with, but whose entries I don't want to miss", it wouldn't add any people to either - it'd be the same people as now, just split into two.

I would love the option to browse my fo-list, though, but I can see how in practical terms it'd create two tiers of f-lists, and omg, the wank that could come of that!