Languages & Fandom - A Poll

[rodo]

First of all: This is all lian's fault. And the fault of the anonymous person who so generously gifted me with two months of paid time (&hearts). This is also a follow-up post to my last post about fandom and language, in a way. It's also my first poll, so please tell me what I could have done better.

Note: For the purpose of this poll, I won't define "fandom" or "(language) fandom". I'll leave that up to you.

Poll #247 fandom & language

Open to: Registered Users, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 259

View Respondents

What language(s) do you use to participate in fandom?

View Answers

English
259 (100.0%)

German
33 (12.7%)

French
18 (6.9%)

Italian
4 (1.5%)

Dutch
2 (0.8%)

Japanese
13 (5.0%)

Chinese
3 (1.2%)

Spanish
20 (7.7%)

Finnish
0 (0.0%)

Swedish
5 (1.9%)

Russian
8 (3.1%)

Czech
1 (0.4%)

Portuguese
2 (0.8%)

Norwegian
3 (1.2%)

Polish
1 (0.4%)

Hungarian
1 (0.4%)

Turkish
0 (0.0%)

Korean
1 (0.4%)

Greek
0 (0.0%)

Filipino
1 (0.4%)

Indonesian
1 (0.4%)

Hebrew
1 (0.4%)

Danish
4 (1.5%)

Arabic
0 (0.0%)

Other (please specify in the comments)
4 (1.5%)

What language(s) do you use to write and translate fic?

View Answers

English
208 (95.4%)

German
22 (10.1%)

French
9 (4.1%)

Italian
2 (0.9%)

Dutch
2 (0.9%)

Japanese
7 (3.2%)

Chinese
3 (1.4%)

Spanish
15 (6.9%)

Finnish
1 (0.5%)

Swedish
0 (0.0%)

Russian
8 (3.7%)

Czech
1 (0.5%)

Portuguese
2 (0.9%)

Norwegian
0 (0.0%)

Polish
0 (0.0%)

Hungarian
0 (0.0%)

Turkish
0 (0.0%)

Korean
0 (0.0%)

Greek
1 (0.5%)

Filipino
0 (0.0%)

Indonesian
0 (0.0%)

Hebrew
1 (0.5%)

Danish
2 (0.9%)

Arabic
0 (0.0%)

Other (please specify in the comments)
5 (2.3%)

What language(s) did and do you use to read fic and/or follow canon?

View Answers

English
259 (100.0%)

German
37 (14.3%)

French
31 (12.0%)

Italian
7 (2.7%)

Dutch
1 (0.4%)

Japanese
28 (10.8%)

Chinese
5 (1.9%)

Spanish
22 (8.5%)

Finnish
3 (1.2%)

Swedish
5 (1.9%)

Russian
11 (4.2%)

Czech
2 (0.8%)

Portuguese
3 (1.2%)

Norwegian
4 (1.5%)

Polish
2 (0.8%)

Hungarian
2 (0.8%)

Turkish
0 (0.0%)

Korean
0 (0.0%)

Greek
0 (0.0%)

Filipino
2 (0.8%)

Indonesian
0 (0.0%)

Hebrew
1 (0.4%)

Danish
7 (2.7%)

Arabic
0 (0.0%)

Other (please specify in the comments)
1 (0.4%)

What languages do you use to read/write meta?

View Answers

English
249 (97.6%)

German
20 (7.8%)

French
6 (2.4%)

Italian
1 (0.4%)

Dutch
1 (0.4%)

Japanese
3 (1.2%)

Chinese
1 (0.4%)

Spanish
14 (5.5%)

Finnish
2 (0.8%)

Swedish
2 (0.8%)

Russian
7 (2.7%)

Czech
1 (0.4%)

Portuguese
0 (0.0%)

Norwegian
1 (0.4%)

Polish
1 (0.4%)

Hungarian
1 (0.4%)

Turkish
0 (0.0%)

Korean
0 (0.0%)

Greek
1 (0.4%)

Filipino
0 (0.0%)

Indonesian
0 (0.0%)

Hebrew
1 (0.4%)

Danish
1 (0.4%)

Arabic
0 (0.0%)

Other (please specify in the comments)
2 (0.8%)

What is your first language (two or three if you were raised bi- or trilingual)?

View Answers

English
137 (53.1%)

German
38 (14.7%)

French
12 (4.7%)

Italian
3 (1.2%)

Dutch
6 (2.3%)

Japanese
1 (0.4%)

Chinese
10 (3.9%)

Spanish
21 (8.1%)

Finnish
5 (1.9%)

Swedish
10 (3.9%)

Russian
8 (3.1%)

Czech
2 (0.8%)

Portuguese
3 (1.2%)

Norwegian
4 (1.6%)

Polish
2 (0.8%)

Hungarian
2 (0.8%)

Turkish
0 (0.0%)

Korean
0 (0.0%)

Greek
1 (0.4%)

Filipino
4 (1.6%)

Indonesian
0 (0.0%)

Hebrew
3 (1.2%)

Danish
9 (3.5%)

Arabic
1 (0.4%)

Other (please specify in the comments)
14 (5.4%)

What languages do you speak/are you able to read/have you learned?

View Answers

English
228 (89.4%)

German
104 (40.8%)

French
114 (44.7%)

Italian
30 (11.8%)

Dutch
11 (4.3%)

Japanese
38 (14.9%)

Chinese
13 (5.1%)

Spanish
76 (29.8%)

Finnish
6 (2.4%)

Swedish
26 (10.2%)

Russian
20 (7.8%)

Czech
3 (1.2%)

Portuguese
8 (3.1%)

Norwegian
14 (5.5%)

Polish
5 (2.0%)

Hungarian
1 (0.4%)

Turkish
0 (0.0%)

Korean
1 (0.4%)

Greek
3 (1.2%)

Ancient Greek
14 (5.5%)

Latin
46 (18.0%)

Esperanto
1 (0.4%)

Filipino
4 (1.6%)

Indonesian
1 (0.4%)

Hebrew
7 (2.7%)

Danish
17 (6.7%)

Arabic
3 (1.2%)

Other constructed languages (e.g. Klingon - please specify)
1 (0.4%)

Other (please specify)
32 (12.5%)

What was your first fandom (language)?

View Answers

English
204 (78.8%)

German
26 (10.0%)

French
3 (1.2%)

Italian
0 (0.0%)

Dutch
3 (1.2%)

Japanese
1 (0.4%)

Chinese
0 (0.0%)

Spanish
9 (3.5%)

Finnish
1 (0.4%)

Swedish
2 (0.8%)

Russian
4 (1.5%)

Czech
0 (0.0%)

Portuguese
0 (0.0%)

Norwegian
1 (0.4%)

Polish
2 (0.8%)

Hungarian
1 (0.4%)

Turkish
0 (0.0%)

Korean
0 (0.0%)

Greek
0 (0.0%)

Filipino
0 (0.0%)

Indonesian
0 (0.0%)

Hebrew
0 (0.0%)

Danish
1 (0.4%)

Arabic
0 (0.0%)

Other (please specify in the comments)
1 (0.4%)

What was your first fandom (media)?

View Answers

TV Series
94 (36.4%)

Movie
15 (5.8%)

Book
87 (33.7%)

RPF
7 (2.7%)

Game
9 (3.5%)

Anime
33 (12.8%)

Cartoon
2 (0.8%)

Musical/Play
2 (0.8%)

Comic
1 (0.4%)

Manga
8 (3.1%)

What was your first fandon (e.g. Harry Potter)

View Answers

Did you participate in this poll?

View Answers

Yes
258 (100.0%)

PS: I would appreciate it if you would pimp this poll.

Comments

[sabeth]

Um, I ticked Latin and Ancient Greek there because I did study them in high school for 6 and 4 years respectively and I never get to brag about that! But while I'm still okay getting the general gist of simple Latin texts, I'd be completely lost when faced with Ancient Greek, and could thus probably not use it for purposes of fandom participation. :D;;

[rodo]

Don't worry, I clicked Spanish too, and while I do get the gist of simple texts, especially with the help of a dictionary, I'd be lost once it gets more complicated.

But who knows, some fandoms probably use Ancient Greek in some small way. (Alexander?)

[attie]

Hm. Haven't seen any ancient greek in Alexander fandom! But then, it was most active when I was really busy and had no internet at home, so I might just have missed it :)

[kouredios]

If any fandoms use Ancient Greek, I would really love to hear about that. :D

[bettina]

I ticked German for the "What was your first fandom (language)?" question, because mostly I really got into fandom into my early teens when I joined a Star Trek club, which was of course in German. Online fandom was English from the start (mid/late-90s).

[rodo]

That's why I asked for "fandom" and not "online fandom" and it's also why I didn't define "fandom". The internet has only really been around for about fifteen years and not everyone entered fandom then! Also: Everyone has a different idea regarding when you become part of a fandom. I wrote fanfic for myself when I was seven, but I don't think I was part of fandom then.

[bettina]

Everyone has a different idea regarding when you become part of a fandom. I wrote fanfic for myself when I was seven, but I don't think I was part of fandom then.

That's true. Looking back I've always been sort of fannish, even as a little girl. I've loved Trek since I was very little (I started having a crush on Spock when I was six ;-).

Fannish behaviour back then, yes. Being in fandom, not really. Being in fandom comes when you meet other people who like the same things. It was quite the revelation when I found that

Star Trek

club *g*.

[scribblesinink]

Oh, it'll be interesting to see the results!

(And since you asked for comments on the poll itself: the question "What language(s) do you use to write and translate fic?" might have worked better as two questions. I do write, but never have translated a single piece of fic in my life :-) I did interpret it as "What language(s) do you use to write fic?")

[rodo]

... And not everyone writes/translates at all. Some only translate, other's only write. I just wanted to know what languages were used to produce fannish fictional texts (and yes, I think translating falls under producing), but I thought this was more transparent.

[aquaeri]

Yep, I'm not a producer (or much of a consumer, really) but I do think I'm in fandom.

[mllesatine]

What languages do you speak/are you able to read/have you learned?

I'm studying Polish, Serbian/Croatian/Bosnian and I learned French in school. French is mostly gone but I hope I will be able to participate in fandom one day using Polish and SerCroBo. I talked to a few people in fandom circles using Polish but we didn't talk about anything fandom-related.

[rodo]

Whoo, Polish! I wish I could speak it, but my grandparents never bothered to teach my father and so he couldn't teach me.

[mllesatine]

Pity. That has happened a lot in your grandparent's generation, I think.

[rodo]

It did. I also can kind of understand it. My father was bullied in school for being Polish, and his parents had to leave Poland for being German. So they all just tried to fit in as best as they could.

And my father ended up learning mostly profanities because the only time my grandparents spoke Polish was when they didn't want the children to understand their arguments.

[whatistigerbalm]

You get a YAY! from this Croatian fan.

[eumelkeks]

I will pimp it, now that I have my internetz back!

[christycorr]

Tee hee. Portuguese-speaking fandom represent!

I saw a Merlin fic in Hebrew somewhere in my flist a couple of weeks ago, and the very thought of fanfiction in Hebrew blew my mind a little—I'm so used to associating the language with quasi-exclusive religious usage!

Anyway. Yes. The poll shall be duly pimped.

[anotherslashfan]

I'm kind of confused because I remember starting with Zetsuai/Bronze fic, but that was in English - still, I read mostly German fic in the first year... it's been eight years, I just don't remember anymore.

[rodo]

I'd say it's up to you. Or you can leave that one (I suppose - first poll, I don't quite know how they work yet).

[khana]

have you linked this to metafandom? it might get less skewered towards German if fid it that way...?

[rodo]

No. I always feel weird linking myself.

[khana]

that was supposed to mean 'if people found it' at some point...

*goes to find out how and where to submit stuff to metafandom*

[lian]

I commented with a link to the most recent post :) but it might take a while or never show up, we'll see!

[xavie]

I like it that you decided not to define 'fandom' in this poll. When I started reading fic on the internet I started out with originals in German. That feels for me like fandom because the stories follow the same patterns and authors and readers are active in roughly the same communities.

[rodo]

I started out writing almost exclusively originals when I joined online fandom, so I know what you mean. The people also often used fandom terms (e.g. slash) and wrote and/or read fanfics as well.

[opengoal]

So... reading counts, right?

[rodo]

It does.

[mllesatine]

Ich habe Originale immer als original fanfic angesehen, weil, wie du schon sagtest, die gleichen Erzählmuster benutzt werden.

[yvi]

I used to translate from English to German, but that was several years ago. Since you wrote 'do', I assume you mean currently?

[rodo]

Yes, I mean currently.

[solesakuma]

... Now I kinda want to get into German fandom.
Reading fic did a lot of good to my English so maybe...
/random

Regarding canons, I try to follow them in the original language if I understand it. If not, in whatever language is uploading quicker (which led to things like watching a series in English, Spanish and French).

[rodo]

Heh, a lot of people who started out in German fandom now only read English fic, because it sometimes can be really hard to find interesting and good German fic.

I prefer the original language for canon as well, if I can understand what's going on at least a bit and if there is no other alternative. That's how I started reading/watching stuff in English as well (Heroic Legend of Arislan). I sometimes read Japanese and English manga as well. And I think I even watched a few episodes of Coffee Prince with bad French subtitles.

[solesakuma]

It's the same with Spanish, so I tend not to rec Spanish fic. Except my flist. My flist is filled with awesome Spanish writers. (They totally spoiled me. XP)
I have a half-baked theory about 'quality' and maturity of the fandom and all, actually, that applies to meta as well. XP

It was the same for me. At first I followed them translated into Spanish but with time, I'd rather listen to the original voices and all. Thankfully, Latin American cable TV is mostly subbed so...
And,OH, BAD FRENCH SUBTITLES. As if it wasn't hard enough to follow them dictionary in hand. XD

[rodo]

I wish people who aren't obvious idiots who can't type would rec German fic (seriously, some of the recs I read had the quality of a youtube comment *shudder*).

"Quality" and "maturity" are some of the aspects, yes. I think it also has to do with being educated to use these sites/methods of interacting. No, social networking sites are not horribly confusing, and yes discussing meta and writing recs are important activities in fandom.

Germany get almost everything dubbed, which is sad for those of us who prefer subtitles. My French sucks big time, but I still understood enough to notice mistakes. Now that is sad.

[solesakuma]

One of the things I've noticed is that the best writers, many times, don't actually post their Spanish fics in the Spanish fandoms and are far more into the English one. I don't kno how it works in German fandom though.

The platforms really do change fandom, don't they? LJ/LJ's clones/DW are far more adequate for discussion, in my mind.

[rodo]

the best writers, many times, don't actually post their Spanish fics in the Spanish fandoms and are far more into the English one.

Same in the German fandom, really. Some people don't because not everyone in Germany actually learned English, but a lot of people prefer to read (and sometimes write) in English. I prefer to read in English but I still write mostly in German. I love the language, for one.

LJ/LJ's clones/DW are far more adequate for discussion, in my mind.

They are indeed. I hate forums and other places for discussions like crazy if they aren't threaded because they are just so impractical and hard to follow if more than two or three people use them. (Had the discussion yesterday, a friend just wouldn't believe me when I told her.)

[solesakuma]

I prefer to read in English but I still write mostly in German. I love the language, for one.

I have no real preference regarding reading. Well, it actually depends on the fandom. There are some I can't read about in Spanish.
And I write in Spanish because I adore the language (it's mine!!!) except, again, for one fandom in particular.

I hate forums and other places for discussions like crazy if they aren't threaded because they are just so impractical and hard to follow if more than two or three people use them.

When Spanish fandom moved from MLs to forums, I left fandom. Then I found LJ and threaded discussions.
For fic, LJ holds no actual advantage but for meta? It's ten times better than forums. MLs compare a little better than forums, though.

[myownspecialself]

for "Other languages" I am able to read: Catalan

[lian]

Rodo, remind me to make a graph for this after this poll has seen a little more participation -- I'd like to see one for ease of comparison's sake :)

[rodo]

Is now a good time to remind you? The poll just hit 200 participants.

[lian]

hah, I was a little impatient and started compiling something after 199 participants already ;D

I'm unhappy with the result, though; I don't think this visualization is very meaningful or compelling. Have a look: Fandom & Languages Graph-- a little outdated, state of early May 21st 09 with 199 participants.

I've been searching for another visualization program, but haven't found anything free and nifty yet. (Basically I'd like to switch the instances of 'languages' and 'questions', but this software only allows 6 different values, so I could not fit the languages in.)

[elefwin]

What languages do you speak/are you able to read/have you learned?
Romanian.

[cafecomics]

2) I used to translate BtVS fic from english to french and I recently translated a PGSM fic from portuguese (brazilian) to french. I write fic in french.

6) What languages do you speak/are you able to read/have you learned?.

Speak/read : french, portuguese, english (8 years in junior high/highschool), spanish (3 years in highschool + 4 at university) <- I read fic in these 4 languages.
Learnt : german (5 years), swedish (3 years) but err... lack of practice = Ich habe fast alles vergessen!

8) I may have started in anime/manga, but I've been most active in US TV series fandoms (BtVS mostly).

As far as I remember, my first fanart was a Goldorak drawing (anime, UFO Robot Grendizer in japanese). I was 6 or 7 and it was pinned on the wall of my CE1 classroom (2nd grade). I entered online fandom years later (at university) through usenet (fr.rec.anime) and my first post was about Sailor Moon (or rather Sailor V).

[magic_at_mungos]

I learnt German and French at school and even thought I could maybe partcipate in fannish behaviour in German. (ie very slowly! :D), I wish I could remember enough French to do so. But I haven't studied French since I was 16 and I'm now 25.

[elleth]

Hi, here via metaquotes on LJ - I just thought I'd leave a note re: poll answers. I'm German, native German speaker, and my first fandom (that is in the sense of active participation on the internet) was the XFiles. I started out in the German fandom exclusively for a while, part of the reason being that my English wasn't sufficient for talking to native speakers, but got sucked into the English part of the fandom via fic reading. For the Tolkien fandom (being my current one since around 2002/3) I started out German as well, but am by now using English for ALL matters regarding fandom, even when talking about it/RPing with German friends - always English, and they reply in the same way. I don't know why, just thought it might be interesting for you. Fandom = exclusively English in all ways.

As for ConLangs, I know some Sindarin, Quenya and a bit of Adûnaic, and in terms of Others, Plattdeutsch, that is Low German as spoken in Northern Germany. Hope this helps some. Interesting poll at any rate.

[rodo]

Actually, a lot of Germans started out in German fandom and then left for the English fandom. And some were never part of the German fandom at all. I was interested in the numbers (not only for German) after my last post, so I posted the poll. I also wanted to know what languages people in fandom were familiar with in general.

Und Plattdüütsch ist jetzt eine eigene Sprache? Für Süddeutsche vielleicht.

[inarticulate]

This poll was hard, because I don't consider myself even so much as "good" in Japanese, but I DO play Japanese-language canons that haven't been translated, and I DO dabble in Japanese fic-reading with extensive (mis?)use of a dictionary. I also dabble in reading in Spanish, but, because there's not the canon component and it's more of a "I am reading fic by friends which happens to be in Spanish (and not understanding a fair amount," I didn't click that ticky box.

For all intents and purposes, I'm English-only.

[rodo]

I'm not good in Japanese either. Especially when it comes to writing/speaking. But when the manga hasn't been translated yet, there's not much of a choice now, is there?

[ex_saved750]

I'm Spanish, not bilingual, started out in the Spanish Harry Potter fandom and soon thereafter ran out of fic to read, so now I'm actually fluent, to some extent, in English, all thanks to fandom. I think that happens a lot--it's not that you don't like your own language, it's that the content in it is just not enough after a while, and eventually you forget how to write prose in your mother tongue.

That may be just me, though.

Anyway, I wanted to clarify that I only read fic in Spanish now if I know the author and am detached enough from the canon to take the dialogue as it is rather than translate it in my head as I read. I'd read fic in the other languages I can read (high school French, Portuguese is very similar to Spanish, took a few months of Italian a while ago) if, you know, I stumbled across something interesting. Which I never do.

[rodo]

Nope, not just you. If you have a day or two to spare you can did throught the comments on my other post (linked above).

if, you know, I stumbled across something interesting. Which I never do.

I think that's the main reason. If you primarily read in English, you don't have the chance to stumble upon fic in other languages, because it's posted elsewhere or in some special place on the archive. (The worst case of that is aff.net, if you ask me.)

[ex_saved750]

Yeah, I took a look at it when it got linked on metafandom (which is how I got to this one as well). I'm not sure I saw anyone who was completely incapable of writing decent prose in their mother tongue (as opposed to not doing it for canon-compliance reasons or because the readership is better in English), though. I honestly just can't write decently in Spanish anymore. Meta, essays, that's fine, but prose comes out robotic.

What I do find fascinating is that there are (predominantly femslashy) fandoms for a couple of Spanish TV shows (that I don't watch) in English, but AFAIK there is no Spanish fandom for them. Not the kind that writes fic, anyway. (I'm aware this is also the case with a bunch of other gay storylines in European TV in general, mind you, I just find it... interesting.)

I've actively searched for fic in other languages before, but I really don't know where to look and don't want to wade through pages and pages of crap on an archive for five minutes of entertainment.

[rodo]

I think a few people mentioned how it was too difficult for them to write fic in their native tongue, but I'm too lazy to look for them (285 comments ... that's a lot). lian said she might write a round-up post for them.

And yes, I think the same goes for German soaps as well. There are 16 fics on ff.de for Verbotene Liebe, but the soap already has a fanlore entry for some reason.

Whenever I look for long plotty Harry/Draco fic in German, I either end up finding translated English fic or fics by this one particular author that I hate. *sigh* I wish there were proper reclists.

[ex_saved750]

I can definitely relate to your H/D woes. I remember that sweet, innocent time in my life when I was sweet and innocent and actually enjoyed what was posted in the Spanish section of ff.net. That's another thing with switching to English fandom--it makes you picky faster than any fandom in any other language, just by virtue of there being enough good fic to satisfy one's cravings. Just another vicious circle, I suppose.

[sabinetzin]

I had to go and change my answer, because I almost forgot- I've written fic that was partially in Nahuatl. I also read a little bit of classical Yucatec.

[rodo]

I've written fic that was partially in Nahuatl.

*is interested* What fandom and what other language and what was it about?

[sabinetzin]

It's an SGA fic; the remainder's in English. It's very short and located over here.

[rodo]

I most certainly sounds I like a fic inspired by a dream ;)

Can't say much about the fandom, though. I've only watched a handfull of episodes.

[alchemia]

My "other" responses are all for American Sign Language (asl)

Also, I was trilingual ASL/english/polish when young, but i have since forgot 99% of it, so I didn't check that one; I wasn't entirely sure if I should or not.

[calime]

Well, my first language is Other, that is Estonian, but the fandom participation is mostly exclusively in English (mainly due to the source canon being in English - and this is why the few ficcy things I write are in English, too).
And re: the languages I've learned - Swedish and Latin are purely on the level of 'have learned and have some rudimentary knowledge of'. English is a language I probably read even more in than in my native Estonian, and Finnish and Russian I can read and get by in, but not as well as in English.
Also, I'm sure you are aware that your poll results are most likely going to be skewed towards the English language users, even if it gets pimped far and wide, am I right? (not meant as a criticism, just an observation).

[rodo]

Also, I'm sure you are aware that your poll results are most likely going to be skewed towards the English language users, even if it gets pimped far and wide, am I right? (not meant as a criticism, just an observation).

Yup, I sort of expected that. Since the poll is in English and on a LJ-like website, there's not much of a chance of anyone but those who read English to find it. And actually, before the poll got linked via metafandom, most people who answered used English for fandom puposes, but the native language that was chosen the most was German.

[fragmentedspace]

my first language is spanish but my interactions in fandom have always been in english 90% of the time. i'm not complaining though, i'd be much less fluent in the language otherwise.

it took me a long time to be able to read fic in my own language without finding it off-putting, and even so, reading in english still feels more natural.

[ariadneelda]

Interesting poll!

I first read Harry Potter in Greek (I'm Greek) but I wasn't in fandom back then, so I don't consider it my first fandom language. Since I got into fandom after the fifth HP book, I've only read canon (and fic) in English. In all other fandoms too, I only read and watch things in English. (For anime, I need English subtitles.) One thing is certain, my English has improved a lot in the last five years. ;)

I didn't reply to your second question since I don't write or translate fic; I make fanart. And I'm not sure I should have checked German as a language I speak. I did learn it but I have forgotten it and can barely speak it now. I wouldn't be able to read fic in German.

[jassanja]

I'd say Swiss German is my first language
For young children there really is a big diffrence, and politicans are currently having a fight if Swiss German or "proper" German should be used by teachers when comunicating with pupils outside of grammer classes

[rodo]

For northern Germans like me there's a difference as well. I think Dutch is easier to understand, tbh.